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dan1dad

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need some quick, valid advice on possible abduction
« on: April 29, 2009, 01:52:56 AM »
My X is not a US citizen. She is Australian. I had to pull the passports and notify every agency that not to allow my daughters out or the country  Dont know if that helps, but she has no passports, and I understand can not get them without my signature.   Anyway , her family has mentioned before about sneaking them out as once in Australia they would fight custody on their turf, with their rules and could hide my daughters and my x out for years down there before anyone could find them.  
So my X demanded that neither of us could leave the state without each others permission. I agreed to that. She thought it would prevent me from taking my daughters to see their grandparents in Illinois ( we are in Missouri) but later she agreed to let me take them to my parents whenever I wanted, but I could not go elsewhere without both of us agreeing on this.  
Now she has broke the rule a few times herself, and I didnt say much. She is the 'do as I say, not as I do' type of person, very selfish , arrogant and of course whatever she wants is correct no matter what the circumstances are.  I once on a weekend trip to my parents took my daughters on the ferry that crossed from southern illinois into into Kentucy, turned around and took the ferry back, and you would have thought I had made my daughters smoke crack as much of a chewing out I recieved for not first getting the ok from my X just to cross the state line that day.  And I have never made even the slightest suggestion of moving, much less leaving the country as she has. But she is a control freak and this is what she does.

So the past few years have been fairly quiet, only an occasional grumble about her not being able to take the girls and live in Australia with them.  She of course continues to break rules like changing daycares and doctors without us agreeing upon it. But she follows those up with a very unrealistic "sorry, I forgot" line and a smug smile. But I always figure its best to let her break all the rules for whenever I get enough money to hire an attorney to get the joint custory we originally agreed upon.
Ok side track. She left me after I was injured at work. She spent a lot of my settlement that was for my medical and rehabilitation, and funnled some to an account she opened up in Australia when we went on vacation there not long before she divorced me. It was a whole marriage of deception and lies, and I was the gullible party who has paid dearly. Just to give you an idea, it was on a Thursday she tells me that she loved me and would never want to be married to anyone else. She was going to stay with me until the end of time...  That following Tuesday , she tells me she cant stand me, is divorcing me, and has been dating someone else for over a year.   Lets just say she is not the most honest, or trustworthy person on earth.

Anyway, she left when I was having my spinal surgeries so i was not sure if I would even be able to watch my daughters on my own then as they were young still. 1 and 3 years of age.  So we made an agreement that if I eventually recouperated to a point where watching them was not a problem, I would get Joint physical custody.  I did recover and have no problem tacking care of them. But now she says she has changed her mind, but has never told me why.  Originally I had ask the arbitrators during the child custody hearing to add that to the agreement, but the arbittrator said there is no specific spot for it on the form, so we would just have to make it a verbal agreement.  
Now one thing I learned with dealing with insurance companies and workers comp during my accident, was to record everything and save it.  MP3 players are great recorders, so I used that for everything during the divorce. I have her in arbitration agreeing to this. I even have the arbitrator saying what she said, and I have my X saying she changed her mind.  I dont know if I can use them later, but I hope I can.

So let me get back to the matter at hand. Her mother is coming over, and today my X anounces that they are going to take the girls to Florida over summer vacation if I will agree to the extra days.   Now my attorney friend who was a divorce attorney for many years told me to many people sneak kids out through florida, dont take the chance.  Since we have an agreeement not allowing travel to states without both parties agreeing on it, all I have to do is say no. Of coures that didnt work, now she says her attorney told her she doesnt have to do that , she can just go but has to tell me that she is going, and give me contact details.
So I told her I wont agree to the days.  She says she will do it anyway.
Her mother had said they want to bring my X and our daughters to live in australia soon, and I had better be preparied to just deal with it because they were going to do it.  Ive had threats of possible death from other family members as well.  They figure if I was dead, then there would be no problem with moving our daughters to Australia.  For an idea of how these people think, my X and her mom faked child abuse against my X's own father because they were mad at him.  My X said later she had told her father that she was sorry, but that was years after they did this.  
So basically I am scared shitless here.  I can not afford an attorney on my disability and now part time work.  She is really talking about leaving, and I know Florida is a great way out.  To many charter boats to take them anywhere they want to go.   I have a good friend who ran a fishing charter for many years down there in the 1970's, and he said he had seen people leave the country all the time. He was approached several times with very good money offers to do it, but he didnt want to take the chance of getting caught.  So I know it happens, I know she wants to. I know her family wants it done and I know with their history what they are capible of doing.  My question is, what I can do to stop it?  Or do I just have to wait and see if it happens, then go through all the trouble David is going through?  I cant afford an attonery.  I demanded arbitrations as we can agree on the summer schedule and locations, but her attorney can postpone that until after she goes to florida. Then it could be to late.
Are there no rights for US citizen parents and children?  My daughters do not have dual citizenship either, they are only US citizens. Thank goodness we didnt get that finsihed like she wanted to before the divorce came around.  What can i do?

Sorry for the length, but I thought a little background would help here as most things are never black and white.

Offline Teena

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Re: need some quick, valid advice on possible abduction
« Reply #1 on: April 29, 2009, 08:54:01 AM »
I don't know what to do. Hopefully Tweinstein and Carlos will read this soon. I would say to go to court TODAY! Explain your case and fight for full custody. I don't think you need a lawyer to go to family court. It would be better if you had one but desperate times call for desperate measures.
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Offline alleycat

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Re: need some quick, valid advice on possible abduction
« Reply #2 on: April 29, 2009, 09:43:55 AM »
what the he__ is wrong with people.?  These evil people ALWAYS put the child in the middle ..... I will never in my life time figure out the demented thinking of parents who totally do this to their children.

Offline sue

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Re: need some quick, valid advice on possible abduction
« Reply #3 on: April 29, 2009, 10:35:44 AM »
They can do an emergency hearing right away and I would go and do that now.  They sound like bully's, terrible and scary.  PM Tweinstein and ask him how you go about this, he would know.

Offline Sashia

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Re: need some quick, valid advice on possible abduction
« Reply #4 on: April 29, 2009, 11:22:28 AM »
It's time to crank up the phone calls. Where do you suggest we start? with SOS Clinton?

Offline sue

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Re: need some quick, valid advice on possible abduction
« Reply #5 on: April 29, 2009, 11:30:55 AM »
We need to get a list of these children and LBP names and email the proper authority, a mass email.  We need to make sure this stops happening.  And I would think a phone call to the proper authority should make them go out and have a chat with this mother about threatening to take her children out of the country.  They need to start doing things before this happens.  This man should be able to contact someone who will take the time to go out and talk to the mother and ask why she is threatening this and tell her what can and will happen if she does this.

Offline tweinstein

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Re: need some quick, valid advice on possible abduction
« Reply #6 on: April 29, 2009, 11:51:36 AM »
You've got a lot of things going on. Why not start here and keep us updated on how things go. You are looking for an attorney who will work pro-bono or for a very reduced fee.
 
http://www.lsmo.org/Home/PublicWeb
   Legal Services of Missouri
Legal Services of Southern Missouri
2872 S. Meadowbrook
Springfield, MO 65807
   (417) 881-1397
in Missouri: (800) 444-4863
Fax (417) 881-2159
I also spoke to someone at: 573-442-0116. The person I spoke to said there are 11 different offices depending on the county you live in. Although neither of these numbers may be the number for your county, they can direct you to the correct office.

Offline Teena

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Re: need some quick, valid advice on possible abduction
« Reply #7 on: April 29, 2009, 12:15:18 PM »
Quote from: tweinstein;20064
You've got a lot of things going on. Why not start here and keep us updated on how things go. You are looking for an attorney who will work pro-bono or for a very reduced fee.
 
http://www.lsmo.org/Home/PublicWeb
   Legal Services of Missouri
Legal Services of Southern Missouri
2872 S. Meadowbrook
Springfield, MO 65807
   (417) 881-1397
in Missouri: (800) 444-4863
Fax (417) 881-2159
I also spoke to someone at: 573-442-0116. The person I spoke to said there are 11 different offices depending on the county you live in. Although neither of these numbers may be the number for your county, they can direct you to the correct office.
Tweinstein...you rock!
Teena Duffy
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BringSeanHome.org

Offline Sashia

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Re: need some quick, valid advice on possible abduction
« Reply #8 on: April 29, 2009, 12:51:41 PM »
Quote from: Sashia;20054
It's time to crank up the phone calls. Where do you suggest we start? with SOS Clinton?
oops!! Posted in the wrong thread lol. Meant to post elsewhere, but was reading this one too.

dan1dad

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Re: need some quick, valid advice on possible abduction
« Reply #9 on: April 29, 2009, 01:33:59 PM »
Wow, thanks to everyone.  Ive just taken all of this in the past because i didnt want my daughters to see us in a fight over them.  I think it will make them feel they need to choose one parent over another, and even though I may no longer have an ounce of love, like, or respect for their mother, its not my place to interfere between them and their mother unless she is doing something to harm them.  Which I have had to interfere a few times because of things she was trying to convience them of that were not true. Luckily my daughters were smart enough to know it was a lie before I said anything.

I am calling the places you suggested today and also see about an emergency hearing.  She , having a lot more money than I do already has a good attorney, so i will be fighting against him,not her. and he is very good friends with the people in the family courts as well.  So I will have a double hill to climb.  I never thought about an emergency hearing, I will check on that today as well.  However, the springfield Mo help usually will not include the city of St. Louis.  Here I have not been able to find any legal help for child custody. Thats big money here and no one is willing to take it on at reduced price or cost. Even the ones listed as Pro Bono lawyers. Everyone I called have either said they dont have the time, or they are already booked.  Now if I had a high profile case, I am sure I could find someone easily.  
I'll keep you all updated on this, as your the greatest help Ive ever recieved and I really appreciated it.    

I really dont want to stop them from being with their mother, but I dont want to allow her to take them away form me completely.  She will just not try to work things out unless I just agree to everything she wishes.  Im really getting tired of this, as well as my daughters crying that they dont get to see me as much as they want.  But my biggest fear is her and her families past history of claiming child abuse.   I wont even let my 6 year old lay in my bed and watch tv she has me to pariniod over it.   I absolutely hate being afraid to hug, give them a kiss them much less let them fall asleep in my bed when they are scared at night from a nightmare, because of knowing what their mother and her family  is capible of.  My daughters hate this as well, and its just hard to try to explain to them so I wont.  I think that is the hardest part of all of this. Always worrying about what she could do.  
And knowing she will if she doesnt get her way.  That is my only real worry about pursuing this. But if I dont, they might be gone and I wll never see them again.

dan1dad

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Re: need some quick, valid advice on possible abduction
« Reply #10 on: April 29, 2009, 01:41:50 PM »
How can I fight for full custody?  Im disabled, dont make 1/3 of what she does, and cant afford an attorney.  I lost my butt during the divorce and custody hearings thanks to no attorney, and falling for a verbal agreement deal, which was brokered by her attorney.
we are talking about the United States courts, in Missouri.  Money, influence, and the buddy system prevails here. Not what is right or best.   I learned that the hard way.

Offline Teena

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Re: need some quick, valid advice on possible abduction
« Reply #11 on: April 29, 2009, 01:42:02 PM »
Seems to me you would have a case of parental alienation also.
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BringSeanHome.org

Offline Wendy

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Re: need some quick, valid advice on possible abduction
« Reply #12 on: April 29, 2009, 01:46:55 PM »
dan1dad...how old are your girls?  It's despicable what parents will do to their children! Doesn't this woman realize what she's doing to her girls?!  Sad.  Tim gave you excellent advice...be sure and follow it.  I would also ask Devon for some input.  He was in the exact same boat as you, calling authorities and trying to have them stop Nadias mother from abducting her but was not successful since no crime had yet been committed.  Of course by the time there was a crime it was too late! I sure hope you have better success than he did!  Please keep us posted!
History has demonstrated that the most notable winners usually encountered heartbreaking obstacles before they triumphed. They won because they refused to become discouraged by their defeats.
 
~ B. C. Forbes ~
 
"It doesn't matter which way you cut this. If you abduct a child from a country and remove it from its parents, its other parent and its extended family and its culture, it is one of the most extreme forms of child abuse that you can inflict upon a child."

well said by Ken Thompson.

Offline SageDad

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Re: need some quick, valid advice on possible abduction
« Reply #13 on: April 29, 2009, 01:47:19 PM »
The good news is that you have very little to worry about in terms of international child abduction to Australia.  Australia takes the Hague Convention VERY seriously and is quick to return abducted children or help Australian parents that have had their children abducted.  If I could pick one place for my son to be abducted to it would be Australia.  I would be more concerned about your wife taking you to court and convincing a judge to legally allow her to move to Australia with the children.
“What you seek is seeking you.”
― Rumi

Offline sue

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Re: need some quick, valid advice on possible abduction
« Reply #14 on: April 29, 2009, 01:54:10 PM »
That's good to know Carlos.  If both parents have been ordered to not take the children out of the country and this woman does, then they will be returned.  Unless she takes them to a different country.  Either way I would be on the phone telling whoever I can that I am being threatened by this woman taking my children out of the country and we need an emergency hearing.  Do you have any custody of the children?