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Author Topic: Breaking NEWS - Judge decides Sean should stay in Brazil.  (Read 54885 times)

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Offline curious67

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Brazilian disinformation
« Reply #495 on: June 08, 2009, 06:28:46 AM »
Quote from: tweinstein;27297
I would like to chime in here as a father who has been fighting for nearly 3 years with the Brazilian legal system.
 
Curious 67,
We have discussed much of what you are saying in terms of evidence. The fact is that this was a case of abduction. If the Hague Convention was complied with by Brazil in accordance with the way it was written, all of this would be irrelevant. The only evidence David needs to show is that Sean was illegally retained in Brazil beyond the anticipated 2 week vacation. End of story.

You are right.

But facts are:

  • things do not happen the way you say and wish they were
  • there is total ignorance about facts in Brazil
  • honest well meaning people in Brazil were led to believe that Goldman is a bad penniless negligent father and will not change their opinion just because of unproven hearsay by people they don't know nor respect. This is why I keep repeating: furnish hard irrefutable proof
  • there is strong emphasis on Sean's "wishes". Honest well meaning Brazilians think Goldman is selfishly acting against the kid's best interest. Only very forceful information campaigns can counter what Lins e Silva's desinformation campaign sowed. You have the entire Brazilian public opinion against you. That needs to be changed.

Offline caique mateus

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Re: Brazilian disinformation
« Reply #496 on: June 08, 2009, 06:54:03 AM »
Quote from: curious67;29807
... You have the entire Brazilian public opinion against you.     ...

Not true. Yes, some powerfull ones are making a lot of noise. Not even with this "help" David has "the entire Brazilian public opinion" against him. Even in Rio de Janeiro I saw some numbers (48% think Sean should stay in Brazil) that, considering everything Globo is doing, are not bad. Almost all they see is Globo, could be 100% against David, yet 52% want Sean to come home.

 
Evidence is and was shown long ago, loud and clear.

Offline Genenut

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Re: Turn around Brazilian public opinion! Disprove wrong allegations!
« Reply #497 on: June 08, 2009, 08:28:49 AM »
Quote from: curious67;27228



 The woman should be very aware of the local customs to avoid being raped. When in Arabia, wear a veil, for example, and don't drive a car if you don't have to and bring a chaperon male relative to accompany you at all times. If you neglect this, don't be surprised about the consequences. And no, I don't agree with the consequences, but they are to be expected (if it is not rape, then it is whip lashing or expulsion from the country)

 

No woman wears a sign that says RAPE ME regardless of what she might be wearing or doing.... I find this comment VERY demeaning and highly insulting.
So a female US soldier in Arabia who obviously cant have a male relative with her is fair game for rape????? A US buisnesswoman who happens to be in Arabia on buisness and drives to a meeting is asking for rape?  I dont think so.

RAPE is NEVER justified.

Go back under what ever rock you crawled out from under.

Offline buckeye

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Re: Breaking NEWS - Judge decides Sean should stay in Brazil.
« Reply #498 on: June 08, 2009, 10:38:51 AM »
Quote from: Teena;25159
If they can decide in 24 hours to keep Sean in Brazil why can't they decide that quickly to send him home?!

Because they don't want to - they do not have and have never had Seans best interests at heart.  The Dark Side is paying alot of money to continue to hurt Sean and David just to say they "won"
 
That poor baby.:bawling:

Offline kathne

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Re: Breaking NEWS - Judge decides Sean should stay in Brazil.
« Reply #499 on: June 08, 2009, 12:51:35 PM »
i've seen in some youtube comments and comments on news sites, these kinds of ideas:
 
"people shouldn't marry brazilians because they'll get themselves in this kind of trouble"
"marry a foreigner and this is what you'll get"
"if you've already had one kid stolen, think carefully about the next person you marry"
 
people who make such comments are frustrated with the lawlessness and want to make things "right".  they feel justice is out of balance, and so they rush out a "statement" to return order.  rather than turning their anger at the courts (the protectors of law) to make things right, they turn ON the victims to make things right.
 
"if you hadn't worn that skirt, you wouldn't have been raped"
"the arsonist wouldn't have burned your house if you had lived in a tee pee"
 
if the idea is to remove risk of kidnapping entirely from a man's life, the best thing a man can do is never have a child period.  no child, no theft of child, simple as that.  men could simply say, i can't take the heartache, the law exists but isn't enforced, given those realities, forget about it.  but we women are lucky men don't say that, and society benefits from the fact that men don't say that.  heck, society EXISTS from the fact that men don't say that.  the idea is not to blame the victim but rather to continue pressing on our court systems, and from our pressing, remind:  the law exists, can we now please have fair, impartial, interpretation of the law and speedy implementation of the law?
 
by parallel example,
if you never want to be in a car accident, it's easy.  never drive a car, never walk on sidewalks near cars.  and then your risk of car accident is reduced enormously.
but people want to drive cars.  and so they buy car insurance.  and the car insurance, once purchased, becomes a legal contract.  and when the accident happens and the car is totaled, the idea is that the car insurance company upholds the legal contract rather than saying, "we are not in the mood today" or "we favor the balance sheet of our company, and a payout is not in our best interest" or "we identify with our company's employees, not so much with you, our client, and so we are taking a match to that contract".
 
in life men are going to do risky things like marry women, have children with those women, and drive cars.  the idea is that the law exists and legal contracts exist to provide a stable backdrop of lawfullness, to discourage lawlessness, and to provide legal recourse should lawlessness occur.  our society depends upon the existance of law AND the following of that law.
 
this case is about a dad and his boy and their human rights to be together.  but it's about more than that also.  it's about society and the smooth beautiful fair right-side UP running of society, at the most macro level.  
 
and in recognition of american women who have had their children stolen by brazilian husbands, and who also like to drive cars, i want to acknowledge there is risk for ANY human to leave their bedroom and interact with other humans in any way, if either scenario exists 1) no laws or 2) laws, but willy nilly, biased, or neglectful interpretation and enforcement of those laws.
 
best wishes to everyone in american and brazil and all over the world as they leave their bedrooms today.
 
kathne

Offline momofthree

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Re: Breaking NEWS - Judge decides Sean should stay in Brazil.
« Reply #500 on: June 08, 2009, 12:56:58 PM »
"marry a foreigner and this is what you'll get"

I'm European, married to an American.....does this mean my husband should be worried? I think NOT, most people have the common sense to know that children need both a mother and father, no matter what happens with their relationship!

Offline kathne

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Re: Breaking NEWS - Judge decides Sean should stay in Brazil.
« Reply #501 on: June 08, 2009, 01:04:55 PM »
Quote from: momofthree;29899
"marry a foreigner and this is what you'll get"
 
I'm European, married to an American.....does this mean my husband should be worried? I think NOT, most people have the common sense to know that children need both a mother and father, no matter what happens with their relationship!

 
momofthree you rock, and it's wonderful that you and most humans on the planet have common sense and know what kids need.  however, in cases where people don't have common sense and instead prefer to be lawless, it's important that laws exist and that the court implements the laws of the land IN the land.
 
so basically i agree with you.  common sense is wonderful and important.  it keeps laws from being violated in the first place.  but we need those laws for those who have the sense of a goose.
 
and i think it's important that we not blame victims, when we're frustrated and trying to restore order in our heads:).
 
i haven't seen comments on this web site about "don't marry foreigners" but i have seen them out on the web, on youtube, etc., made by people who feel frustrated by the injustice and are trying to work out a solution in their heads.

Offline heatheram29

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Re: Breaking NEWS - Judge decides Sean should stay in Brazil.
« Reply #502 on: June 08, 2009, 01:21:12 PM »
I think it's time to close this thread. Every time it pops up again I think we got new bad news.

Offline AnotherDad

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Re: Breaking NEWS - Judge decides Sean should stay in Brazil.
« Reply #503 on: June 08, 2009, 02:02:14 PM »
The problem with this thread and the discussions about what we should do, is that we are for the moment, way beyond those efforts. Also, we have discussed all of these issues in this forum ad nauseum. I know I personally have sent multiple posts on several of these topics.
 
We need this Wednesday business to be behind us and then we discuss how much of the old stuff we dig up and work on again. Until then, this is all re-hash. We are at the STF currently and we just need to close this and regroup if we have to fight more and fight harder on these old topics. Does anyone else agree?

Offline BrazilianForJustice

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Re: Breaking NEWS - Judge decides Sean should stay in Brazil.
« Reply #504 on: June 08, 2009, 02:18:40 PM »
Quote from: momofthree;29899
"marry a foreigner and this is what you'll get"

I'm European, married to an American.....does this mean my husband should be worried? I think NOT, most people have the common sense to know that children need both a mother and father, no matter what happens with their relationship!

If your husband were Brazilian, and even more if you were a man and your wife was Brazilian, you SHOULD be very worried, as Brazil is a state-sponsor of international child abduction. America is an enforcer against those rogue states, NOT one of them. Now, Germany is a problem...

Offline BrazilianForJustice

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Re: Breaking NEWS - Judge decides Sean should stay in Brazil.
« Reply #505 on: June 08, 2009, 02:24:37 PM »
Quote from: AnotherDad;29952
The problem with this thread and the discussions about what we should do, is that we are for the moment, way beyond those efforts. Also, we have discussed all of these issues in this forum ad nauseum. I know I personally have sent multiple posts on several of these topics.
 
We need this Wednesday business to be behind us and then we discuss how much of the old stuff we dig up and work on again. Until then, this is all re-hash. We are at the STF currently and we just need to close this and regroup if we have to fight more and fight harder on these old topics. Does anyone else agree?

I think that for the people new to the Goldman case and the crimes against the other children and their law-abiding parents, they deserve all the rich information here and that should be a continued effort.